Hi
I received the December issue of Freewheel today , shipped by snail mail , delivered by motor packet boat
[ Viking longship??]to the new world port of Montreal . I was intrigued to find that the RSR subscrition has increased , in order to defray mailing costs .
I have written to the Editor to point out that this is a case of putting a 19th century horse firmly behind a 21st century cart .
Instead of fighting reality I proposed that the RSR should adopt the subscription model used for several years by Canadian and US car clubs .
The RSR base subscription would include an Internet version of Freewheel . Any one needing a paper copy would pay a surcharge which reflects the cost of printing and packaging and the actual cost of postage .
This enables every one to choose their preferred method of obtaining Freewheel and pay the costs involved.
I await developments with interest !
Cheers
Patrick
Logic behind Increased RSR subscription ??
-
patrick hiron
- Posts: 19
- Joined: Mon Nov 03, 2008 4:30 am
Re: Logic behind Increased RSR subscription ??
Hello All, and Patrick,
Well I have to disagree and agree with your assesment Patrick. I think the club has to act in the interests of all the members and therefore cannot ask the internetless memebers to bear the unequal cost of printing the magazine. I also have been considering the issues of memebership and club missions for sometime now especialy with all the discussions raised about club memebership falling and costs rising for memeber services. I was moved to respond at length on the P4 forum post a month or so ago on what I feel would assist car clubs and particularly the many Rover clubs with the changing times. I have pasted the text below. I t is important to note that many of these ideas are already in progress so most is not new.
It is bit wordy so I apologize in advance.
I am a overseas member and honestly have been made to feel extremly welcome by all and everyone I have met within the club. With this said I aplogize in advance for offending anyone and if these are redundant suggestions. So here goes. I believe that UK Rover clubs are the best in the world and I think that the clubs can cooperate and remain seperate and find ways to drastically reduces expenses while increasing membership. Yes I think we can have our cake and eat it too.
I think the issue of joining a car club in most instances comes down to marketing.
I think that you first have to ask what is the mission of the club and if the answer is to promote the interest in the marque and support others who share the same ideals then you have to look at things like this forum as an absolute sucess.
This is true whetether it means new members join or not if you to are stay true to your ideals.
Now if you want new members both young and old then you need to really look at how to best comunicte the benfits and experiances the club offers. I think this revolves around two main areas the club magazine and cooperation.
The following are my ideas for enhancements that could be made to how the club operates the club magazines, the forum and how it interacts with other clubs.
1) Have dues for the club be separated from the magazine cost and the
postage. This will allow you to raise or lower dues independently of mail
costs and vise versa
2) Consider offering Club magazine subscription by its self. Have the cost for post be what it needs to be for the given location. This helps keep the volume up for the printers and allows you to have non-member sales with the hope of converting them to members. Besides there maybe a number of old and current members who do not have a Rover any longer
but want to stay connected to the club and otherwise would let there
membership lapse. There is the feeling that if you join a club you need to
own a car by separating it then people may be more apt to subscribe.
3) Offer Overseas memberships at the same price as UK memberships so it is both fair and you don't have to worry about how to handle the difference in costs for posting the magazine. For some reason I know non UK members feel put off by the difference because they do not understand the costs or consider the costs for sending the magazine to them. and feel discriminated against for being non UK. You of course have to now offer a little bit for them within the magazine for non UK members to keep them hooked.
For whatever reason people think that the only benefit to them is the club magazine. This is simply not the case it is one of perception and this can be changed by engaging both memebers and non memebers first with the services the club offers but are not well known and then wih a few changes to how the club promotes itself and the ownership of Rover.
4) Offer to overseas members a email version of the Club magazine. However they donot get an actual email with an attachment they get an email with a link to download it from an FTP site. They need to have there member number to enter into the download page and they can only do it once so they cannot pass this on to other non members. This can also be setup on the forum or website where a download link resides and this can be done in the members section.
5) Offer a digital version to members as an addition to there hard copy
subscription to Club magazine (but they cannot have it instead as this would raise printing costs) at an additional 2 to 5 GBP For notification purposes you can have this setup on the website or forum. You can market the reason to get more for this option is that all issues will be available to be downloaded by them should they loose there hard copy or prefer to have both for there convenience. This will also promote more activity on the forum as well.
Other things to consider to drive up membership and to enhance the overall perception of the club.
1) Offer discount memberships to members of other Rover clubs for the first
year. Many club members have more then one model Rover so being a part of
another club is an easy decision if you make it easy. Make this offer to
club leadership of these other clubs and offer to reciprocate I can see this working
between all the Rover clubs and in particular the P5, RSR the P6 clubs the SD1 club.
2) Formally invite other clubs to participate in major club events. Make a
big deal out of it with a formal printed invite and they will likely print
it in their club magazines and the club will get free publicly. This drives membership up
this also gets more paying entries in and it will drive our own members to
make a good show of things. Do this even if it is only for the National meet
and have proper awards for them.
3) Begin a membership drive and request that every member actively try and
get one person to join the club. offer this at 1/2 price for the first year.
Bear in mind that this is based on separating the membership from the Club magazine
mailing costs.
4) Add a full B/W page to the club magazine as a tear out member application. Make
it real easy for people to join. Call old members and ask them to rejoin.
Also consider a 1 time trial magazine for people who are considering joing the club. Just ask for post costs.
In otherwords use the magazine more often as a marketing tool.
5) Offer Rover clubs outside the UK who cater to all models an associate
member status or club charter status or similar things like this. It gives a
degree of credibility to them to think the the mother country has recognized
them. Provide them with some kind of inexpensive plaque recognizing them and
invite co-membership in the club in the UK. The club gets someone else to
be providing going ons in there region that can be added to the club
overseas section so they will be happy to share and feel a part of things.
and the club needs filler stock to make things interesting to all.
6) Create a board level post at the club that is a liaison to other Rover clubs
and encourage these clubs to do the same.
This post needs to be someone who will attend meetings bring and take cooperation suggestions back and forth to the club leadership. This would all be done with the goal of finding ways to lower costs together and to find ways to do
more together and enhance the experience for everyone involved with Rover.
7) Article exchanges with each others magazines Hey we love all the models and it is fun now and then to read an article about another Rover.
Cooperate on printing. This may be a way to lower overall costs. I know the P5 club and the RSR have very similar formats.
9) Ask overseas members to assist in a membership drive. You know they know where the owners are lets take advatage of this and it involves them more.
10) Have 2 to 4 contests a year that involve restoration, membership
additions overseas accomplishments, best advice award winning article, best
interior, best engine compartment etc. Keep momentum going get some member
voting going use the forum to get the word out. Give people a reason
something is new and therefore to participate more frequently. You can even
offer this to non members with the prize being a years dues.
11) Email hotline for advice offered as a club service and formalize who
and when a reply will occur even perhaps offer a phone number for certain
time so members can get reasonable advice.
You could also do this on the forum as it is done now just promote it more
12) Spot light a vendor each month with a page about them in addition to
their ad in the back. Make them a part of the club from the members point of
view and invite new ones to come in and advertise. Treat them all well and do
not show favorites. Encourage them to be a part of club events.
Offer them a stand space at the National if they
commit to a a year of advertising.
13) Call old members and ask them to rejoin or if they are interested in a
subscription to Club magazine only. If they have complaints then listen to them and
tell them you will let the committee know you may be surprised how many will
come back just for asking.
14) Offer 2 and 5 year memberships if the post cost is separated from dues.
15) Consider a juniors memebership for under 21 owners
These are some of my thoughts that have been brewing over the last few
years. I am in this for the cars and to promote it to others I also
understand that I am a outsider and may not have all the facts in hand so if this is the case I apologize to anyone I may have offended.
My two Pence
Dirk in he States
www.roveramerica.com
Rovers from 1926 to 1990
(lots of P4s my favorite).[/i]
Well I have to disagree and agree with your assesment Patrick. I think the club has to act in the interests of all the members and therefore cannot ask the internetless memebers to bear the unequal cost of printing the magazine. I also have been considering the issues of memebership and club missions for sometime now especialy with all the discussions raised about club memebership falling and costs rising for memeber services. I was moved to respond at length on the P4 forum post a month or so ago on what I feel would assist car clubs and particularly the many Rover clubs with the changing times. I have pasted the text below. I t is important to note that many of these ideas are already in progress so most is not new.
It is bit wordy so I apologize in advance.
I am a overseas member and honestly have been made to feel extremly welcome by all and everyone I have met within the club. With this said I aplogize in advance for offending anyone and if these are redundant suggestions. So here goes. I believe that UK Rover clubs are the best in the world and I think that the clubs can cooperate and remain seperate and find ways to drastically reduces expenses while increasing membership. Yes I think we can have our cake and eat it too.
I think the issue of joining a car club in most instances comes down to marketing.
I think that you first have to ask what is the mission of the club and if the answer is to promote the interest in the marque and support others who share the same ideals then you have to look at things like this forum as an absolute sucess.
This is true whetether it means new members join or not if you to are stay true to your ideals.
Now if you want new members both young and old then you need to really look at how to best comunicte the benfits and experiances the club offers. I think this revolves around two main areas the club magazine and cooperation.
The following are my ideas for enhancements that could be made to how the club operates the club magazines, the forum and how it interacts with other clubs.
1) Have dues for the club be separated from the magazine cost and the
postage. This will allow you to raise or lower dues independently of mail
costs and vise versa
2) Consider offering Club magazine subscription by its self. Have the cost for post be what it needs to be for the given location. This helps keep the volume up for the printers and allows you to have non-member sales with the hope of converting them to members. Besides there maybe a number of old and current members who do not have a Rover any longer
but want to stay connected to the club and otherwise would let there
membership lapse. There is the feeling that if you join a club you need to
own a car by separating it then people may be more apt to subscribe.
3) Offer Overseas memberships at the same price as UK memberships so it is both fair and you don't have to worry about how to handle the difference in costs for posting the magazine. For some reason I know non UK members feel put off by the difference because they do not understand the costs or consider the costs for sending the magazine to them. and feel discriminated against for being non UK. You of course have to now offer a little bit for them within the magazine for non UK members to keep them hooked.
For whatever reason people think that the only benefit to them is the club magazine. This is simply not the case it is one of perception and this can be changed by engaging both memebers and non memebers first with the services the club offers but are not well known and then wih a few changes to how the club promotes itself and the ownership of Rover.
4) Offer to overseas members a email version of the Club magazine. However they donot get an actual email with an attachment they get an email with a link to download it from an FTP site. They need to have there member number to enter into the download page and they can only do it once so they cannot pass this on to other non members. This can also be setup on the forum or website where a download link resides and this can be done in the members section.
5) Offer a digital version to members as an addition to there hard copy
subscription to Club magazine (but they cannot have it instead as this would raise printing costs) at an additional 2 to 5 GBP For notification purposes you can have this setup on the website or forum. You can market the reason to get more for this option is that all issues will be available to be downloaded by them should they loose there hard copy or prefer to have both for there convenience. This will also promote more activity on the forum as well.
Other things to consider to drive up membership and to enhance the overall perception of the club.
1) Offer discount memberships to members of other Rover clubs for the first
year. Many club members have more then one model Rover so being a part of
another club is an easy decision if you make it easy. Make this offer to
club leadership of these other clubs and offer to reciprocate I can see this working
between all the Rover clubs and in particular the P5, RSR the P6 clubs the SD1 club.
2) Formally invite other clubs to participate in major club events. Make a
big deal out of it with a formal printed invite and they will likely print
it in their club magazines and the club will get free publicly. This drives membership up
this also gets more paying entries in and it will drive our own members to
make a good show of things. Do this even if it is only for the National meet
and have proper awards for them.
3) Begin a membership drive and request that every member actively try and
get one person to join the club. offer this at 1/2 price for the first year.
Bear in mind that this is based on separating the membership from the Club magazine
mailing costs.
4) Add a full B/W page to the club magazine as a tear out member application. Make
it real easy for people to join. Call old members and ask them to rejoin.
Also consider a 1 time trial magazine for people who are considering joing the club. Just ask for post costs.
In otherwords use the magazine more often as a marketing tool.
5) Offer Rover clubs outside the UK who cater to all models an associate
member status or club charter status or similar things like this. It gives a
degree of credibility to them to think the the mother country has recognized
them. Provide them with some kind of inexpensive plaque recognizing them and
invite co-membership in the club in the UK. The club gets someone else to
be providing going ons in there region that can be added to the club
overseas section so they will be happy to share and feel a part of things.
and the club needs filler stock to make things interesting to all.
6) Create a board level post at the club that is a liaison to other Rover clubs
and encourage these clubs to do the same.
This post needs to be someone who will attend meetings bring and take cooperation suggestions back and forth to the club leadership. This would all be done with the goal of finding ways to lower costs together and to find ways to do
more together and enhance the experience for everyone involved with Rover.
7) Article exchanges with each others magazines Hey we love all the models and it is fun now and then to read an article about another Rover.
Cooperate on printing. This may be a way to lower overall costs. I know the P5 club and the RSR have very similar formats.
9) Ask overseas members to assist in a membership drive. You know they know where the owners are lets take advatage of this and it involves them more.
10) Have 2 to 4 contests a year that involve restoration, membership
additions overseas accomplishments, best advice award winning article, best
interior, best engine compartment etc. Keep momentum going get some member
voting going use the forum to get the word out. Give people a reason
something is new and therefore to participate more frequently. You can even
offer this to non members with the prize being a years dues.
11) Email hotline for advice offered as a club service and formalize who
and when a reply will occur even perhaps offer a phone number for certain
time so members can get reasonable advice.
You could also do this on the forum as it is done now just promote it more
12) Spot light a vendor each month with a page about them in addition to
their ad in the back. Make them a part of the club from the members point of
view and invite new ones to come in and advertise. Treat them all well and do
not show favorites. Encourage them to be a part of club events.
Offer them a stand space at the National if they
commit to a a year of advertising.
13) Call old members and ask them to rejoin or if they are interested in a
subscription to Club magazine only. If they have complaints then listen to them and
tell them you will let the committee know you may be surprised how many will
come back just for asking.
14) Offer 2 and 5 year memberships if the post cost is separated from dues.
15) Consider a juniors memebership for under 21 owners
These are some of my thoughts that have been brewing over the last few
years. I am in this for the cars and to promote it to others I also
understand that I am a outsider and may not have all the facts in hand so if this is the case I apologize to anyone I may have offended.
My two Pence
Dirk in he States
www.roveramerica.com
Rovers from 1926 to 1990
(lots of P4s my favorite).[/i]
-
richard moss
- Posts: 233
- Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 5:23 pm
- Location: Wolverhampton
Re: Logic behind Increased RSR subscription ??
A great many clubs now offer two levels of subscription - one for a paper magazine and a lower one for internet only.
Internet subscriptions are perfect for overseas members as they get the magazine at the same time as everyone else (indeed, ahead of UK postal deliveries) and it's easier to store! An example of this is the Rover 200 owner's club (website http://www.rover200.org.uk) and I have never seen any club member complain about the price differential.
Perhaps an alternative to sending it by email would be to burn it onto a CD ROM (about 30p a go) and post it. That would be a lot cheaper than printing a paper copy, there could be a lot more colour and if anyone wants a hard copy they can print off the emailed/CD version so that they have something to read when paying their respects to Thomas Crapper! You'd only have to print out the bits that were relevant to you, then - the reprinting of the FBHVC newsletter is completely pointless, as far as I can see, especially as that organisation actually does very little of tangible value to the classic car owning fraternity at large (they didn't even put up a fight against classics going to the crusher under the scrappage scheme and seem to be opposed to people using classics as daily drivers).
I have to be honest and say that I have never read more than about 10-15% of Freewheel - often I read none of it at all, putting it straight into the recycling bin or dropping it off at the doctors surgery. It contains little or nothing of relevance to me and, if I'm brutally honest, is the worst owners club magazine I have ever seen. I'm sorry if that gives offence but I feel that honesty is important here. If I had a choice of membership whereby I wasn't paying for a magazine that I don't read then I may still be a member of the RSR - but the price of renewal put me off because I really don't feel that I got value for money for my last subscription.
Dirk won't agree with me - but then that's nothing new!
Internet subscriptions are perfect for overseas members as they get the magazine at the same time as everyone else (indeed, ahead of UK postal deliveries) and it's easier to store! An example of this is the Rover 200 owner's club (website http://www.rover200.org.uk) and I have never seen any club member complain about the price differential.
Perhaps an alternative to sending it by email would be to burn it onto a CD ROM (about 30p a go) and post it. That would be a lot cheaper than printing a paper copy, there could be a lot more colour and if anyone wants a hard copy they can print off the emailed/CD version so that they have something to read when paying their respects to Thomas Crapper! You'd only have to print out the bits that were relevant to you, then - the reprinting of the FBHVC newsletter is completely pointless, as far as I can see, especially as that organisation actually does very little of tangible value to the classic car owning fraternity at large (they didn't even put up a fight against classics going to the crusher under the scrappage scheme and seem to be opposed to people using classics as daily drivers).
I have to be honest and say that I have never read more than about 10-15% of Freewheel - often I read none of it at all, putting it straight into the recycling bin or dropping it off at the doctors surgery. It contains little or nothing of relevance to me and, if I'm brutally honest, is the worst owners club magazine I have ever seen. I'm sorry if that gives offence but I feel that honesty is important here. If I had a choice of membership whereby I wasn't paying for a magazine that I don't read then I may still be a member of the RSR - but the price of renewal put me off because I really don't feel that I got value for money for my last subscription.
Really? I think that the magazine is one of the LEAST important aspects of club membership - it's out of date before it arrives. A forum like this is much more immediate, more relevant and certainly more responsive and interactive. The days of sending a letter to the editor and then waiting two - three months for a reply in the mag are long gone. You can post a question on this forum and may well have several answers within a day or two. Doing "business" via a forum is the future, whether or not the more traditional members like it or not.Dirkco wrote:people think that the only benefit to them is the club magazine.
Dirk won't agree with me - but then that's nothing new!
1990 827 Sterling manual
1990 Jaguar Sovereign 4 Litre on LPG
1969 MGC GT (currently hibernating)
1990 Jaguar Sovereign 4 Litre on LPG
1969 MGC GT (currently hibernating)
Re: Logic behind Increased RSR subscription ??
Hi Richard,
Thanks for the thoughtful reply!
I do agree with some of your comments but I will disagree on the quality of the Freewheel magazine I do find it informative and it allows me to feel connected to the club being 3000 miles away. However a club magazine can only be as good as contributions of its members so if people want more then sit down and contribute. For me I find that the printed word invokes the same nostagia that the classic cars do. So keep Freewheel coming. But I also understand others may feel differently so I am open to different ways the magazine/information can be delivered. But the club needs to consider all its members and the cost and time that gos into the effort.
I do agree that the forum has now become a signifigant part of the club experiance and offers real time information and useful discussions about policies etc. and the RSR has one of the best forums and thoughtful members to debate with.
I look forward to your reply
Happy Holidays,
Dirk
Thanks for the thoughtful reply!
I do agree with some of your comments but I will disagree on the quality of the Freewheel magazine I do find it informative and it allows me to feel connected to the club being 3000 miles away. However a club magazine can only be as good as contributions of its members so if people want more then sit down and contribute. For me I find that the printed word invokes the same nostagia that the classic cars do. So keep Freewheel coming. But I also understand others may feel differently so I am open to different ways the magazine/information can be delivered. But the club needs to consider all its members and the cost and time that gos into the effort.
I do agree that the forum has now become a signifigant part of the club experiance and offers real time information and useful discussions about policies etc. and the RSR has one of the best forums and thoughtful members to debate with.
I look forward to your reply
Happy Holidays,
Dirk
-
richard moss
- Posts: 233
- Joined: Wed Sep 24, 2008 5:23 pm
- Location: Wolverhampton
Re: Logic behind Increased RSR subscription ??
I offered the editor a link to my 800 forum, with my full permission to download and use any of the many articles that I've put on there. Items such as fitting LPG to an 800, "How to" articles, a buyers guide etc. - and I also made the same offer of my posts on here. However, I was told that he couldn't use them as he didn't have broadband internet to download them - that was when I threw in the towel and decided not to renew.Dirkco wrote:However a club magazine can only be as good as contributions of its members so if people want more then sit down and contribute.
That offer still stands, by the way - even though I'm not renewing my membership, I'm happy for the club to "harvest" my articles.
1990 827 Sterling manual
1990 Jaguar Sovereign 4 Litre on LPG
1969 MGC GT (currently hibernating)
1990 Jaguar Sovereign 4 Litre on LPG
1969 MGC GT (currently hibernating)